Lessons in Chemistry Episode

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Would you like to attach a face to that voice? When you subscribe to the book interrupted YouTube channel, you get to see everybody as well as check out a bunch of extra book interrupted videos and music content. Visit the book interrupted YouTube channel to see what you've been missing. [00:00:15] Speaker B: Parental guidance is recommended because this episode has mature topics and strong language. Here are some moments you can look forward to during this episode of book interrupted. [00:00:27] Speaker A: It's so simple for her, right? Like, it's like math. Nope. I'm also a human and as humans we are the same. [00:00:34] Speaker B: Pretend I'm not offended when somebody asks me to coffee or that I'm the eye candy for the booth. Like I don't, right? Like, that's embarrassing. [00:00:44] Speaker C: Misses John Smith I'm like, no, your name. And she's like, misses John Smith. [00:00:47] Speaker B: I'm like, no, like, your name's not John. [00:00:50] Speaker A: Your name is not John. [00:00:52] Speaker B: She's telling everyone at home how to poison their horrible husbands. Like, I get it. But like, get it. [00:00:58] Speaker A: Like, she had that pencil behind her ear, probably because she's gonna stab whoever else is coming to her. Like, I loved that and I love that. She's like, I wish I had more pencils. [00:01:07] Speaker C: Did the screenwriter never read the book, do you think? Why would you alter something that's so deeply important and ingrained in a character. [00:01:15] Speaker B: And in the series? It didn't seem like that. It seemed more cold. I didn't find Elizabeth thought in the book cold. [00:01:21] Speaker A: And I'm playing Calvin and Sarah's playing 630. [00:01:26] Speaker C: They were speaking more about the feminist narrative that, oh, here we go again. That it's men who were, you know, terrible to women. So that was the legit in the sixties. [00:01:37] Speaker A: That was actually true. My body is home. Information is divine. Trying to learn something new without being disrupted. Mind, body and soul inspiration is with us and we're gonna talk on book interrupted. [00:02:14] Speaker B: Welcome to book interrupted. A book club for busy people to connect and one that celebrates life's interruptions. During this book cycle, we're reading Virginia's book lessons in chemistry by Bonnie Garmis. This book was made into a tv miniseries in 2023 and stars Brie Larson, Lewis Pullman, Aja Naomi King, Kevin Sussman and Patrick Walker. In the early 1960s, a working chemist, Elizabeth thought, is not your average woman. Like science, though, life is unpredictable. She finds herself not only a single mother, but also the star of a cooking show, supper at six. Elizabeths unusual chemist approach to cooking proves revolutionary. But as her following grows, not everyone is happy because as it turns out, Elizabeth Zod isnt just teaching women how to cook. She's daring them to change the status quo. Let's listen in to this episode's group discussion. [00:03:17] Speaker C: So we, so first of all, I'm super happy to be back here with all of you chatting about books that have made it to the big screen or little screen. Right? So my choice was the book called lessons in Chemistry by Bonnie Garmis. It is also available on Apple TV as episodes as well. So it was on the little screen. So Bonnie Garmis, it's her debut novel and it tells a story about Elizabeth Zott. So it's set in the 1960s in southern California. It's a romantic comedy. But what's interesting is it has a lot of undertones, actually, not even undertones, overtones of feminism and challenging the status quo, which is really interesting. And so, yeah, it's a great book. So I'm happy to that we can dive in and chat about it. So. [00:04:15] Speaker B: So I read the book before our season, okay. And loved it. And then on our season three finale, I was like, I already know it's gonna be my favorite. It's an amazing book. And have that as her debut book. [00:04:29] Speaker C: I know, right? Yeah. [00:04:31] Speaker B: Amazing. [00:04:32] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:04:33] Speaker B: Yeah. I really, really like the book. And I agree. It's an overtone of feminism in ithemenous. I just really like Elizabeth Saott's character so much. What do you like about it? The people from subvert six, you know, they feel inspired by her. I feel inspired by her too. Like, she just constantly does. It's hard to do. It's hard to say, no, that's not true. Because I've worked in industries where it's male dominated and I play the game and pretend I'm not offended when somebody asks me to coffee or that I'm the eye candy for the booth. Like, I don't. Right? Like, that's embarrassing. But I'm just like, oh, ha, ha, ha. But she doesn't do that. I found her very inspiring because she's like. And occasionally to certain men I worked with that I thought could hear it, I would say things like, yeah, don't do that. They would say something like, oh, I'm going to hell, or, ha, ha, ha. I'm like, yeah, I'm really trying to prevent you from doing that. So sometimes in my life, I would say that to so certain men, but in a room full of men, I wouldn't. And I found that inspiring that she just always, she wasn't being pushed into the box she was forced into because she just was like, that's not right. And I refuse to go into it, even though you keep on beating me down. [00:05:52] Speaker A: Yeah. She was so true to herself. [00:05:54] Speaker C: Yes. [00:05:55] Speaker B: So true to herself. Yeah, I really liked that. [00:05:58] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:05:58] Speaker A: Right. [00:05:58] Speaker C: Cause oftentimes it wasn't easy for her. Right. [00:06:01] Speaker A: Extra hard in the sixties. [00:06:02] Speaker C: 100%. [00:06:03] Speaker B: Yes. [00:06:04] Speaker C: Right. Yeah. No, it's true. And it was interesting how even misses frask, you know, that she also, I heard one time it being described as the crab mentality, where women also try to pull other women down. I was thinking of her about this crab mentality, and it's interesting how you couldn't raise a woman up back then, you know, like, you. I don't know. She was, like, saying that Elizabeth was riding on Calvin's coattails. So I thought that was really interesting. [00:06:32] Speaker A: And everyone just assumed it. No one even considered that she might not be sleeping with him or she might actually be a gifted chemist herself or any of it, because she was a woman. So automatically, she couldn't be a, b, c, d, e. So you must be doing f. Yeah, exactly. [00:06:52] Speaker C: Yeah. What do you think, Kim, of it in general? [00:06:55] Speaker A: Well, I didn't know that it was that writer's first book, so that makes it even that much better, because I love the story anyway for everything that Sarah said and what you've already mentioned. But I also really love the way the story's told. I love a story that, like, unfolds and starts somewhere else and then goes back in time for a minute. And just the storytelling itself, the story itself is great, but the way the story was told was also a huge kind of positive for me in that experience. And, yeah, Elizabeth Zott's character is awesome. I love exactly what Sarah was saying. She's so true to herself. I just love how, like, it's so simple for her. Right? Like, it's like math. Nope. I'm also a human, and as humans, we are the same. You know, like, we are equal. And so. And I love how, like, confused and incredulous she is when people are like, well, you can't possibly. And she's like, why can't I possibly? I have two legs and three. I was gonna say three arms. I have two legs and three arms. Of course, I can juggle different butt, but you know what I mean? Like, she'd, like, say some biological fact, right? Like, well, I. As much oxygen as the human lungs, so of course I can do that, you know, like, whatever. And I like just how simplified it was, because it gets complicated and confusing, and she's just like, one plus one equals two. Like, what are you doing? [00:08:17] Speaker C: And I love, too, that Calvin had the exact same mindset towards that as well. And I feel like that was their catalyst or their TSN turning moment in their relationship, you know, when he apologized for thinking she was a secretary, you know, not for throwing up on her, you know, but saying, like, I would imagine from her point of view, that's, like, the most lovely thing you could possibly say to her, you know, that would make her see him in a different light. But I love that Calvin also was sharing the exact same sentiments about, well, why would you say you're facing discrimination? You know, gender discrimination. You're human. You know, you're a chemist. And I thought it was really good for him to also be saying that as well and also, like, a big eye opener that you couldn't imagine unless you go through it right. The discrimination, being held back, less opportunities, not being able to meet your full potential, you know, at that time, because you are a woman, you know? So I thought that was interesting, too. [00:09:13] Speaker A: I think that also it was a relief that Calvin didn't need to be convinced of the discrimination or the feminist point of view, but he was originally a little bit blind to it by virtue of being a male. Like, that's not something he's spending his time really considering. But when she told him about it, he was like, oh, and like, again, oh, yes, you're right. That adds up. I'm with you. Like, it wasn't just like, are you sure? Maybe you're being sensitive, all of that shit. Right. So. [00:09:39] Speaker C: And I feel like in the episodes on Apple, they did a better job of exemplifying that, that Calvin really understood it. Do you remember in that episode how when she went to that review board, the science review board, Calvin wanted her to be in first position for the study they were doing, and they said no. Right. You could see it firsthand. So I thought they did a better job in that or an even an even better job in the episodes on that as well. So I'm highlighting that, too. I didn't like. [00:10:07] Speaker A: Now that you're talking about the episodes, I didn't like them as much as the book. [00:10:11] Speaker C: Me neither. [00:10:11] Speaker A: Yeah. I thought that it was interesting because I was sure, like, I was like, yes. Like, I love this book, and now I can't wait to watch this show. I think it's because of whatever I can't point out specifically, but the, like, minute changes, because there were changes between the book and the episodes in the way that the story was told there was nothing wrong with the original. Like, it was very excellent, in fact. And just the tweaks here and this, that and being a little bit different, I wasn't. I understand, I guess, like, for example, with the assault by the professor when she was going for her masters. I can understand how it would be a challenge to try to lay that out the way the book laid it up. You have a mini series, limited edition. You know, these limited series, you can actually do it. So just do it right. Make that one episode that's only her at college, and we'll all realize, like, oh, shit. I don't know. I just. I didn't finish it. The Apple tv ones, I didn't care to go back to them. No, I didn't even care. I'm like, I consumed it and I loved it, and now I don't really need to consume it again because it's not right. You know? Like, it's not what I loved. It's. And it's just ever so different. [00:11:16] Speaker B: But the end was different, too. I want to talk about that then, since you didn't watch the end, I'll say so the book, the end, I cried because his mom and her are hugging, because they both had the same kind of horrible discrimination their entire lives that ruined their lives. And they're holding each other and crying over Calvin and their lives and everything that happened to them. And it was a really moving part of the book. And in the movie, they made it like she was contemplating if she's going to be part of her family, do you know what I mean? [00:11:52] Speaker A: Like. [00:11:52] Speaker B: Or if she's going to let her help her with funding and stuff. Like, she was just. It was like, I'm going to think of it over. It wasn't as, now we're immediately a family. Do you know what I mean? Which. [00:12:02] Speaker A: Yeah, because you've got this shared experience. [00:12:04] Speaker B: Like, I'm inviting you to dinner. You're on the family tree. We're all together. This is our family now. Instantly, you're accepted. I understand what happened to you. Do you know what I mean? [00:12:14] Speaker A: Whereas, yeah, let's move forward together. [00:12:16] Speaker B: And then the series, it didn't seem like that. It seemed very more cold. I didn't find Elizabeth thought in the book cold. She just was righteous or whatever. You know what I mean? Like, she was like, this is right, this is wrong. Here are the facts. But she was a caring person. It's like when she talked about when Harriet got abused, and she immediately went on her show and did a thing about poison mushrooms and talked about basically abuse. [00:12:41] Speaker A: Right. I remember now. I was actually torn because there's probably a narrative around, like, oh, once again, showing a family of color with dysfunction in it. I bet you there's a line of, I want to say questioning, but that's not right. Where people would be like, that's not cool. Like, why isn't the white family, like, whatever, right? Because that's like a low key version of racism. Like, look at every time we show a black person, they're doing something negative or experiencing something negative, they're not successful. So I did appreciate that the Apple version didn't venture into Harriet being an abused wife or the husband being whatever. Like, that's fine. But still, it was part of the story. I just wanted the story to stay the same the way that I read it. That's a hard one, though, because I can see the other side where it's like, no, we're going to stay away from portraying people of color in this way. [00:13:31] Speaker B: Definitely. I preferred the way they did portray them, but. Right. That they took out that narrative, which. [00:13:36] Speaker A: And then it changed, like, because a lot of things were kind of attached to that. [00:13:40] Speaker C: Yeah. Some of the reviews I was reading was saying just that they were speaking more about the feminist narrative, that, oh, here we go again, that it's men who are, you know, terrible to women. So that was the legit in the sixties. [00:13:53] Speaker A: That was actually true. We're talking about the sixties here. [00:13:58] Speaker C: Yes. Right. Yeah, I know. I don't understand this total blind ignorance, but that was some of the comments to her. So not necessarily the racist part of it, but more of, like the feminist part of it. So I found the same thing about the episodes. I feel like some of the sentiments were the same, but they changed it too much. And I really would imagine that Bonnie karmas wouldn't be really happy about that ending because it's almost like a culmination. [00:14:24] Speaker A: Yes, exactly. [00:14:27] Speaker C: Of the women going through constant shittiness in their lives because of their women in the sixties all throughout, really every generation, but still, let's just say the sixties. [00:14:37] Speaker A: Okay. [00:14:37] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:14:38] Speaker C: You know, and then also that they understand each other and that they have each other for support, this, like womanhood. So it's really. I'd imagine Bonnie, she ever came on, would not. [00:14:51] Speaker A: It's an important theme that got altered. Right. And it's like, this is the main theme, and that's one of the main ways that she drove it home in the beautiful, putting the puzzle together way. And they changed it. [00:15:04] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:15:05] Speaker A: Probably because there's a male executive deciding how we're doing it. [00:15:10] Speaker C: Right. It's true. Okay, let me ask you about the dog then. What did you think about the. The dog being the narrator in part of it for the book? [00:15:20] Speaker A: I was cool with it. It was, like, weird for a second, and then I was fine with it. Especially because the dog is also super smart. Right. Like, it just makes sense. I hated how they changed everything in the book about the dog. [00:15:32] Speaker C: A lot about the book that they didn't need to. Need to do it. Yeah. It's weird even how the dog came into their lives. Yeah. [00:15:39] Speaker B: They changed all of it. [00:15:40] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:15:41] Speaker A: Like, it just made sense in the book and in the show. It was like, why are you changing it? There's no need to change this. [00:15:47] Speaker C: Yeah, agreed. See, I found it kind of annoying. I will say. When I first was reading it, I was like, give me a freaking break. It's dog. But it grew on me because the dog was an extension of their family. Right. Like, really smart and helping out in science and chemistry and the experiments, the cooking, and so it made sense as it went on. But when I was first reading it, I was like, oh, my God, I was loving it. [00:16:11] Speaker A: It was a good way to add some context, right? That wasn't from Elizabeth's point of view and wasn't from Calvin's point of view. And, you know, like, what? Whatever. It's a talking dog. [00:16:20] Speaker B: No, I loved it. I found it so endearing. I even put in my personal journal because he was, like, protective and also the doctor being like, okay, you got a dog, you got an erg, and you got a neighbor. You're good. You're good. You're gonna be fine. Like, I loved all of it. I loved the character of the dog, how much he was part of the family and what he was thinking all the time. And, like, Kim, because he was smart. If it was just like, I would be like, cares about this dog. But I really cared about the dog. Like, I was so invested in 630. I was like, I love this dog. [00:16:50] Speaker C: Dog. [00:16:51] Speaker B: So much. Anyway. [00:16:55] Speaker A: I think, though, this is against everything I've been saying so far. If they did the dog's voice in the show, did they do the dog's voice in the show? [00:17:04] Speaker B: No, I don't think so. [00:17:05] Speaker A: Then I don't think I would have liked it either. Right. If now I'm watching the internal narrative of the dog in the show, like, literally some voice actor is saying, you know what I mean? I may have liked the show even less than I already liked it. Maybe. Maybe if they kept it the exact same, I might have gone okay with a narrator for the dog, but I. [00:17:24] Speaker C: Think some things don't translate well. Did you guys ever read the book the beach? You know, the Leonardo DiCaprio? [00:17:30] Speaker B: Yes. I didn't read the book. [00:17:32] Speaker A: Yeah. I didn't read the book. Watched the movie. [00:17:34] Speaker C: You didn't read. Oh, okay. So they had a part in there. So you may not remember because it's so long ago, but in the movie, it almost had, like, a video game quality to it at some part in the movie. [00:17:46] Speaker A: Was he on drugs? [00:17:47] Speaker B: Oh, yes, yes. [00:17:48] Speaker C: Do you remember that? He was almost, like, losing his mind a bit, I think is more of it, so. But he was also marijuana Field, but. So in the book, it was done a million times better than the movie. So I think some things like that don't translate very well, you know? [00:18:02] Speaker A: Well, I also want to challenge, like, directors. I think that they could, but maybe it's, like, a little more creativity or, like, test it out and see. Did that actually translate? Because it is hard to bring a vision in your head to, you know, the screen. I'm not discounting that, but that probably wasn't the only way to portray that scene. And maybe a different director would have done it in a way that did translate well. [00:18:24] Speaker C: Interesting point. Yeah, yeah, maybe. Or at least a better way, for sure. [00:18:29] Speaker A: This is what I want to say. Everything could translate well, but yes, some things don't translate well because the person who translated it didn't necessarily get it. Like, they didn't hit the mark with it. Like, they may have understood it, but they haven't been able to literally translate it. But I think that with enough trying, which nobody has time to do because money, money, money. Like, whatever we could. [00:18:48] Speaker C: Yeah. It's interesting to see with a different director. [00:18:51] Speaker A: Yeah, well, and you can't please all the people all the time. Right? Maybe some people, that's, like, their favorite scene in the movie ever. Like. [00:19:00] Speaker B: Yeah, I remember that scene being like, this is weird. [00:19:03] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. But in the book, it was okay. Almost like the talking dog. Right? Like it was. Yeah, it worked out okay. Yeah. You know what I found interesting in the episodes as well? They focus more on the cooking than they did the book. [00:19:13] Speaker A: Yeah. And not even the good stuff. Like, not even the good stuff. [00:19:17] Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah. I thought that was really interesting too. [00:19:20] Speaker A: Yeah, they sped into it too. Like. [00:19:23] Speaker C: Yes. Right. Yeah. It was always a part, and it wasn't right. [00:19:27] Speaker A: And they missed pieces that were key again to the feminism and the whatever, the arguing about the set, it just wasn't, the whole thing wasn't translated well, actually. [00:19:37] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:19:37] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:19:38] Speaker C: Well, that's interesting. I wonder who directed. [00:19:41] Speaker A: I'll giggle it. [00:19:43] Speaker C: There you go. I wonder if that would be it. Yeah, because. [00:19:45] Speaker B: Yeah, I think that too. The point was that she was inspiring people. Women. Yes. And the rest of the world being like, you deserve to be taken seriously. Yes, we all do. [00:19:57] Speaker C: And that's an important job. And bringing science into cooking. And, yeah, I loved how it was in the book. That viewpoint of equality was from the get go. I loved it about her last name, about marriage. I wasn't 100% sure. I think they should have gone into that a little bit more. But last names and even she talked about how. Because this happened to me. So I'll ask you guys if it's ever happened to you as well. But where a woman goes by the first and last name. So my name is Misses John Smith. [00:20:28] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:20:28] Speaker C: And so she talked about that. Right. And I actually had that experience one time. That was a million years ago. And it was one of my first jobs and I was filling out applications for people for like this furniture company. And it was, you know, like one of those don't pay for two years. So I had to get people's financials. So I asked this woman for her name. She's like, this is John Smith. I'm like, no, your name. And she's like, misses John Smith. [00:20:48] Speaker B: I'm like, no, like, your name's not John. [00:20:51] Speaker A: Your name is not John. [00:20:52] Speaker C: Your name. Right. And so, I mean, I was young and I wasn't going to push the issue, but I remember at that time thinking, this is so freaking weird. You've lost your whole identity. Like your entire identity is gone because you got married. It was so whacked to me when I was 17. [00:21:09] Speaker A: So there are 123345 directors. Each person did two episodes each. They're all women. [00:21:17] Speaker B: Oh, interesting. Uh huh. Okay. Apple TV. That's great. [00:21:24] Speaker A: Like in this day and age, you better know. [00:21:27] Speaker B: No, I know, but it's not necessarily true. [00:21:30] Speaker A: I want to know who is it? A screenplay for tv. [00:21:35] Speaker B: Who wrote the screenplay? Yeah, I thought the casting for Elizabeth was good. [00:21:40] Speaker A: Same. I like her. [00:21:41] Speaker B: I liked her a lot. And I think she did a good job portraying Elizabeth. I just. Yeah, I didn't like the series as much as the book because the book, it just had so much to it. [00:21:52] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:21:52] Speaker B: The mother talking about how because she was unwed mother and she wouldn't sign the papers for her son to be put up to adoption that they just let her be in labor at 17 by herself. [00:22:04] Speaker C: Yeah, in that room and stuff like that. [00:22:06] Speaker B: And then said that Calvin died so she could adopt them out, like, things like that. Or the photographer totally missing the point when he went to the funeral. Or the. Originally the Life magazine guy, although he switched after realizing she opened up and said everything. But originally being like, I don't get her. Let's talk about your hair. Let's talk about your dress. And she's like, did you watch the show? [00:22:33] Speaker C: Yeah, just Mister Poynt altogether. [00:22:35] Speaker B: Like, there's so much in the book. There's so much depth and information. And then the priest, like, lying because he wanted money, because he wanted to get out of the orphanage. He didn't want to do that. There's just so much in the book that they left out in the series that made it less amazing. [00:22:54] Speaker A: The screenwriter is Lee Eisenberg. That is a gentleman. [00:22:59] Speaker B: Oh, gotcha. [00:23:00] Speaker C: So some of the criticism as well is that of the book was that it was too basic. So I know. Did you. So I'm getting. I take it you don't also. You don't agree. I didn't agree. [00:23:12] Speaker A: Not that it was basic at all. I thought it was. The thing that I admire about this author is the way she told that story. And I think the way she told that story, she had to hold a bunch of ideas in her head at the same time and tell it. Like, this is going to be probably more confusing, but I'm trying to simplify it. Say this story has ten parts. 1234-5678 910. And she had to tell it 431-5972 810. And you're, like, cool. Like, the way everything came together with little blips of information and the fact that the daughter bumps into the guy. Well, I can't even remember because I'm confusing the movie in the book. But I liked in the book how that priest plays a part and he's part of the history. The book was perfectly fine. It was really, really good. And it wasn't basic at all. Not at all. Like, I loved, like, the subtle things. Like, she had that pencil behind her ear, probably because she's gonna stab whoever else is coming to her. Like, I love that. And I love that. She's like, I wish I had more pencils. Like, yes, that's lying so great. [00:24:17] Speaker C: Yeah, totally. And you know what? So when we did the promo pics for this, I hadn't read the book or seen the series, so I googled it to get a sense of it. So I did my hair in victory curl. I didn't put the pencil. So, like, after I read the book, I'm like, oh, my gosh, you should. [00:24:33] Speaker A: Have been, like, holding a pencil, you know? [00:24:35] Speaker B: Like, I know. [00:24:36] Speaker C: So now I wish I'd read the book before I did those promo pics, because I just missed. One of the biggest parts of that. [00:24:42] Speaker A: Book was you could have literally dressed up as a pencil. [00:24:44] Speaker C: Yes. My next Halloween costume. No, I'm Elizabeth dawn. But it was nice. I love that. Yeah. I mean, the pencil was so great, right? Because even, like, the whole, you know, commentary about not a pen but a pencil, because you could erase, you know, everyone makes mistakes, and you can erase it. So I was really kicking myself afterwards for, in those victory curls, not having a pencil. [00:25:10] Speaker A: But I feel like that was huge to me because they kind of pointed it out and someone mentioned it, and then later on, you realize you're like, oh, that's like the bear in the woods. Do you know what I mean? Like, she carries a pencil. [00:25:22] Speaker B: Yeah, she's ready. Yeah. [00:25:25] Speaker C: Maybe we could photoshop it in. [00:25:27] Speaker A: She's really regretting it. [00:25:29] Speaker C: I am. I'm not kidding. It got me into the knife. [00:25:31] Speaker B: I'm like, dang it. How about when she pulled out that knife for the meeting with the producer? Is it producer? No, he's station manager or something. [00:25:41] Speaker A: Yeah. The dink. [00:25:42] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:25:43] Speaker A: And then he had a heart attack. [00:25:44] Speaker C: And then he had a heart attack. [00:25:45] Speaker B: And she was so calm, and he couldn't figure it out. Like, in the book, so much better than the series, because in the book, you're reading him being like, why the hell is she not doing what she's supposed to be doing? Like, crying and begging for a job, and hell. And then it gets close, and she just pulls out her knife, and she waited till, like, she was just about to be assaulted. I just loved her so much. Like, you're just like, yes. [00:26:06] Speaker C: And then outsmarted him right before she calls 911, gets him to agree to all the contract stuff. Just outsmarted him. That was really great, too. [00:26:16] Speaker B: So great. [00:26:18] Speaker C: I know. It's good, right? [00:26:19] Speaker B: It's a really good book. Yeah, I highly, highly recommend it. [00:26:23] Speaker C: Me too. You know, I'd love to. Do you guys watch any of the cooking programs on tv? [00:26:28] Speaker A: No, not only reality tv ones. I watch, like, next level chef. [00:26:33] Speaker C: Oh, that. Okay. Gotcha. [00:26:35] Speaker B: Yeah, I watch. There's a chinese one on YouTube. [00:26:39] Speaker A: Walk with Yan. [00:26:40] Speaker B: No, it's a woman who went back to her traditional village, and she. You see it from her, like, growing the plant to make music. [00:26:46] Speaker A: Oh, I feel like I've seen that. [00:26:48] Speaker B: It's really good. It's like Lu Xu or something like that. Her name is Lizu or something. I'm obsessed with it. [00:26:56] Speaker C: Oh, I might look that up. I'll see you. [00:26:58] Speaker B: I'm obsessed with it. It's really good. [00:27:02] Speaker C: So I mention it because we watch a lot in my house about cooking shows and probably, I don't know, in the early two thousands, maybe mid two thousands, there was a guy named Alton Brown and he broke down cooking into chemistry. [00:27:15] Speaker A: Oh, cool. [00:27:16] Speaker C: Yeah, it was really, it's really cool. If you get a chance to see him, he totally breaks it down and says, why you do certain cooking applications. The reason why, like, why do you let a steak rest before you cut into it? [00:27:28] Speaker A: And it's so important. [00:27:29] Speaker C: Yes. [00:27:30] Speaker A: And I learned, like, not resting a steak, but like that information. [00:27:33] Speaker C: Yes, exactly. Yeah. [00:27:35] Speaker A: And resting a steak, I guess. [00:27:37] Speaker C: Yeah. I learned how to make really delicious pancakes because of him. So you have to, like, temper the pan first. And it was really neat. So anyway, it reminded me of that and I loved it. I love, like, the whole concept. [00:27:48] Speaker B: Hold on, wait, that's so true. Because the first pancake always sucks. So I always make the tiniest pancakes. [00:27:53] Speaker C: I'm like. [00:27:54] Speaker B: And then I'm like, I'll just have this tiny pancake. And now I can start making pancakes. [00:27:58] Speaker A: Now they're all golden brown. [00:28:00] Speaker C: That's why it is. [00:28:01] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:28:02] Speaker A: Look at that. Is that what tempering the pan means, sacrificing a pancake? [00:28:06] Speaker C: That. [00:28:07] Speaker B: No, you should probably just warm it up before you start. Where? [00:28:09] Speaker C: I don't. [00:28:10] Speaker B: Is that right? [00:28:10] Speaker A: Oh, I do. And I still have a dud pancake to start. [00:28:13] Speaker B: What exactly is tempering? Is it just you turn it on the heat for a while before you start? [00:28:18] Speaker C: Well, I think that's it. And then how I took it was that do you put the one pancake in and then move it around the pan? Sort of. Get it. What's the chemistry of that? [00:28:26] Speaker A: Get like the pan used to the. [00:28:28] Speaker C: Pancake, I guess, right? Yeah. Okay. [00:28:31] Speaker A: Because the first pancake is always a done. [00:28:33] Speaker B: Yeah, always. [00:28:34] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:28:35] Speaker B: Okay, so tempering the pan is like, you're supposed to get rid of one pancake. [00:28:39] Speaker C: Yeah. So he wrote down the chemistry behind that. [00:28:42] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:28:42] Speaker C: Neat, right? [00:28:43] Speaker B: Oh, great. That's cool. I already do it. So, like, this one's gonna be a dad. Doesn't matter what I do. [00:28:47] Speaker C: Well, there you go. [00:28:48] Speaker A: It doesn't matter what I do. [00:28:51] Speaker B: Great. [00:28:51] Speaker C: I know. It's neat, right? Like, Shane, my husband, he cooks a lot, but in really interesting things, like with aubergine, soaking them in salt first, you know, to help with the rubbery skin or certain mushrooms that you don't use the stems on. Yeah, it's just really interesting stuff when you like. [00:29:07] Speaker A: So this salt soak, is it to help remove the skin or to make it more pallable? [00:29:13] Speaker C: Pal. [00:29:14] Speaker A: I can never say this word. Palatable. [00:29:16] Speaker C: Palpable. [00:29:17] Speaker A: Palpable. No, not palpable. [00:29:19] Speaker C: Palatable. [00:29:20] Speaker A: Palatable. [00:29:21] Speaker B: Palatable. [00:29:24] Speaker A: We're trying to make it less. [00:29:25] Speaker C: Maybe somebody who listens to this good. Like, write it phonetically and then in the. [00:29:29] Speaker A: It would be nice if anyone who listened to this would talk to us, actually, while we're talking about it. Bookies. [00:29:35] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:29:36] Speaker A: Nobody calls, nobody emails. Is anyone even rating us? I feel like we're being listened to by a bunch of bots only. [00:29:44] Speaker C: No, we're not. [00:29:45] Speaker A: Prove me wrong. [00:29:46] Speaker C: My mom does. And Renee. Yeah. It'll be interesting to see if other people have interesting comments about cooking. Cooking and chemistry. [00:29:58] Speaker A: Sure will be. I bet you we'll get radio silence. That's all we ever get when we ask for people to talk to us. [00:30:06] Speaker B: I know we get mentions and people contact us that were, like, authors or agents and that kind of stuff all the time. But hope, we love your show. We want our author to be on it. It's like, okay, great. Like, and subscribe a comment. [00:30:22] Speaker A: Leave a comment rate. [00:30:24] Speaker C: Yes, please. Please, too. Oh, another thing I was thinking about, too, with the episode. You know what I think they missed about Calvin? His lip chewing. I thought that was a big part in the book that they left out. [00:30:37] Speaker B: Yeah, he meant to remember. Yeah. He chewed his lips. [00:30:40] Speaker C: Yeah. But it was, like, woven into the book a lot. So I thought that was interesting that they totally didn't pick up on that. [00:30:47] Speaker B: I think having Calvin as a ghost worked for the show, but I didn't like it. She wouldn't talk to a pretend Calvin that's not. She's not religious or she wouldn't be talking to a pretend Calvin. [00:31:01] Speaker A: You know what I did like, and I feel like it's a testament to, like, I don't know her core. You would think she was raised by really smart, put together ahead of their time kind of parents, and it was actually the total opposite, and yet still the outcome was this super strong, true to herself, really great woman. I'm sure the death of her brother probably had an impact on, like, a commitment to not letting anyone tell you to be something you're not. Maybe. But I just thought that that's a little, not surprising. But it was like a little bit of an interesting twist because I guess, where do you get the strength to be so committed to yourself without any validation from anyone ever until you, like, meet Calvin, you know what I mean? [00:31:51] Speaker B: But I think also they kind of touched on it a little bit because she says that's why she doesn't want her daughter coming to the show, because she doesn't want to be performing like her dad. She doesn't want to pretend to be something she's not ever because that's what she disliked about her father so much that he was never who he said he was. And then also, probably also her brother killing himself because he wasn't allowed to be himself. I think those two things would play into, I'm only going to be true to myself ever, and whatever happens, happens, but I won't be that. [00:32:26] Speaker A: What did her mom do again? Was she just like a sidekick of her dad or. [00:32:30] Speaker B: And then she had to flee to Brazil for tax evasion. [00:32:33] Speaker C: Yeah, I think she was married a whole bunch of times, too. [00:32:36] Speaker A: Well, the mom and the dad were not together forever. [00:32:39] Speaker C: No, he went to prison for his evangelical. [00:32:43] Speaker A: Oh. And then she got married a bunch after that. [00:32:46] Speaker C: And she was married before that, too. Yeah. [00:32:48] Speaker A: Was she a gold digger? [00:32:50] Speaker B: She was only interested in money. That's what it mentioned a lot, that she just cared about the money. And he went to jail because he actually killed two people with one of his. [00:32:58] Speaker C: Oh, that's right. [00:32:59] Speaker A: With his pistachio explosions. [00:33:02] Speaker B: And that's how she got interested in chemistry because. Because of the pistachios. So that's why she went into chemistry. [00:33:08] Speaker A: Right when she liked her dad before the veil was lifted or whatever. [00:33:12] Speaker B: Yeah. There's so much in that book. Do you see, like, so many layers of interesting. [00:33:17] Speaker A: Even the rowing and Calvin's history, too. [00:33:20] Speaker B: Yes, and the rowing. Like, there's so much. [00:33:23] Speaker A: They didn't do anything about the rowing. She's just all of a sudden pregnant, kicking ass on a nerd. There's no, like, you know, examples of sexism while he tries to bring her to the thing and then. And knowing that she can't swim. Like, was that a part in the show? [00:33:35] Speaker B: Yes, in the show. He just. But he discovered it differently. [00:33:38] Speaker A: He had to, like, rescue her, didn't he? [00:33:40] Speaker B: Yeah, in the book, he found out much later and then he didn't have to teach her to swim. That didn't happen in the movie. He found it right away and then taught her how to swim. It was like a romantic moment. That didn't happen in the book. [00:33:52] Speaker C: I didn't love that in the, in the show at all. Yeah. [00:33:56] Speaker A: And I don't know that they really captured, like, the closeness of the relationship between the producer and her. [00:34:02] Speaker C: Oh. [00:34:02] Speaker A: Which I loved. And actually, you know what I did like about the show? How you think that that daughter is someone else. Like, you know how they introduced the girl with the lunch and whatever, and then, like, she goes running by Elizabeth sot because she's actually the producer's daughter. You think that that's what's her name in the beginning? [00:34:20] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:34:20] Speaker A: The reason why I liked that Harriet had a dissatisfied marriage is because she ends up with that producer. I know, I like that. [00:34:28] Speaker B: Me too. [00:34:29] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:34:30] Speaker A: Happy endings. That's why. [00:34:32] Speaker C: Yeah. I like that part in the book better, too, with Harriet as she was there. Because also another mother figure, right. To come in and help her. [00:34:40] Speaker A: She was strong too, in her own way, right? Because she was trapped in what is probably a fairly common example of relationships at that time and still doing what she has to do or, like, living her life, you know, finding a way to go on, even though her reality is nightmare. [00:35:00] Speaker C: And I love how she fought her own biases because she kept seeing strange men coming in and out of the house. Remember how Elizabeth was. [00:35:09] Speaker A: Was helping the, the other guys at Hastings, right. [00:35:12] Speaker C: And so she checked her own bias and came over because she's like, well, I remember what it's like to have a newborn came over and then saw what was really happening. So I thought that was really nice too. [00:35:21] Speaker A: I also like that she's like, I'll get up at four in the morning. Do you mean, like, all of it made sense because she's trying to spend as little time as possible with her dumb husband. [00:35:28] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:35:29] Speaker A: And so she's like, yep, I'll come over at four so you can go row and all, like, be here when. [00:35:33] Speaker B: She'S home from school. [00:35:34] Speaker C: The mushroom episode, the tv. I know, right? It was just brilliant. Yeah, it was cute. [00:35:41] Speaker B: And how Walter was like, oh, shit. She's telling everyone at home how to poison their horrible husbands. Like, I get it. But, like, get it. So getting fired. [00:35:52] Speaker C: Yeah, it's funny because she was funny too, right? Without meaning to be funny, because she's a very serious person. So even the member, the soup cans, she's like, yes. Yeah, I'll tell everybody about this. Sure, no problem. Well, you'll save time because you'll kill your family. Make them food. Oh, that was pretty cute. And again, holding true to herself, so not even thinking about, well, I should just. [00:36:17] Speaker A: I could lose my job or any of it. [00:36:19] Speaker C: Right. [00:36:20] Speaker B: That's another thing that the series sucked at the moment. She promoted the spam. She gave in to something. She would never give up anything. And in the show, they made her be like, I'll promote this because I have to spam. No, it wasn't spam. It was like, it's not lard. [00:36:33] Speaker A: Lard. Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:36:35] Speaker C: Something like that. [00:36:36] Speaker B: Frisco. She was, like, promoting that. [00:36:38] Speaker C: Oh, she would have never done that. [00:36:41] Speaker A: Yeah, she was influenced by that. She might lose her job or whatever. Right. [00:36:44] Speaker C: Did a screenwriter never read the book, do you think? Why would you alter something that's so deeply important and ingrained in a character? Why would you alter that? [00:36:53] Speaker A: I don't think he got it. That's what I'm saying. Like, he didn't actually understand the character and he didn't actually understand those themes that were all impacted by the small, different changes that were made to the screenplay. It could have been two seasons. You know, it could have ended with Calvin dying, and then the next season could have been the whole cooking at six or whatever. [00:37:15] Speaker B: Great idea. [00:37:16] Speaker C: Great idea. [00:37:17] Speaker A: Thank you very much. [00:37:19] Speaker C: I think you should redo it because. [00:37:20] Speaker A: I think I should be the screenwriter. Well, me and Sarah. What were we talking about? We rewrote killers of the Flower moon way better in theory. I mean, we just talked about it. It's not actually pen to paper or anything, but someone make them knock at. [00:37:33] Speaker C: Your door to take you up on that. [00:37:34] Speaker B: I don't know how great it would be if all we ever did is rewrite things that have already been written. I don't know who would buy those. [00:37:41] Speaker A: Scripts, but we could be a whole new thing. Like, we could have, like, a little better. Because there's other people that probably feel like us, right? Like, just, like, there's probably people out there who obviously liked it enough to produce it. I bet you there's people out there that are more diehard to the. But the story. Okay. For Flower Moon, the storytelling was absolutely lacking. [00:38:01] Speaker B: For sure. [00:38:02] Speaker A: There's so many options for telling a good story with that story. For this one, it's like you didn't even need to change anything. No, no author did it perfectly fine. [00:38:13] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. Why bother, right? I think it would make a good gig. Like the final episode of Game of Thrones. Lots of people would love to see that redone. So that could be a new gig. It's redoing bad. [00:38:25] Speaker A: That would be actually, I think that. Yeah. Like, I really do think there's. [00:38:28] Speaker B: I'll start a new company called we did it better. [00:38:31] Speaker A: Yes. [00:38:32] Speaker B: Done better. [00:38:33] Speaker C: Yeah. That's the title of it. I tune in. Yeah, totally. [00:38:40] Speaker A: And we could have a whole thing where it's like, you need to watch episodes one to four because we didn't fuck with those. But then it started to go sideways. So here's how. But then we'd have to get all the actors back. Could you imagine what it would be better is if we did it ourselves? [00:38:53] Speaker C: You're sewing the costumes. [00:38:55] Speaker E: Really low budget. [00:38:57] Speaker A: And I'm playing Calvin and Sarah's playing 630. [00:39:03] Speaker C: You know what? I would get that pencil right this time. [00:39:06] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:39:06] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:39:07] Speaker A: You could definitely be. You could be zot. [00:39:09] Speaker B: You could. Yeah, you could have a pencil. You could be zot. [00:39:13] Speaker C: One thing that would make it in. But I wonder if that. I mean, I don't wonder. I'm quite sure that that's why the episodes weren't as successful as perhaps they could have been. Right. Too much was changed, and it was. [00:39:24] Speaker B: They missed the essence of that movement. It's like super feminist being like, take us seriously. [00:39:30] Speaker C: Yes. [00:39:31] Speaker B: And he didn't get that. Like. [00:39:34] Speaker C: Like, how nonsensical it is to not be taken seriously as a woman. It's just we have all the same DNA. Like, why? You know, it's just nonsense. So. [00:39:42] Speaker A: And Elizabeth Zott really portrayed the character how nonsensical it is. That's exactly what I loved about her. Because the way she reacted to when people did that, it was like, what nonsense are you saying to me right now? I need to get back to my serious business. That's exactly the same as your serious business because we're the same. [00:40:02] Speaker B: And it makes me think the screenwriter actually. Yeah. Really didn't get her character because even having Calvin teach her how to swim, it's like, oh, she needs the man to swim. [00:40:11] Speaker A: She would have learned by herself. [00:40:13] Speaker B: It was like, don't worry. We just went flip the boat. And then she end up joining the six instead of just the two of them because she can't swim. Like, it wasn't like, oh, I need you to help me. [00:40:22] Speaker A: It's a version of rescuing. [00:40:25] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:40:25] Speaker B: She's another rescue. She didn't need rescuing from anyone ever. [00:40:29] Speaker C: No. And she pushed against it too. Right? She never. Yeah. She never would have. Yeah. Well, that's too bad. That's a real mess. [00:40:35] Speaker B: Yes. [00:40:36] Speaker C: Yeah. But I liked it. [00:40:38] Speaker B: We write it again, you'll see. [00:40:43] Speaker C: Anything else that stood out? [00:40:46] Speaker B: Last thoughts, I guess. We all recommend it. And okay. I recommend the book. Obviously, but I wouldn't recommend the show. [00:40:53] Speaker A: I thought that we were saving this for our personal journals. [00:40:57] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. And maybe I actually said in my personal journal, recommended the show, but now that I'm rehashing the show, I'm like, not the show. [00:41:05] Speaker A: Well, we always do when I'm listening to the podcasts. We all finish with our recommendations, and then it goes into personal journals, and then we recommend again or not, depending. [00:41:16] Speaker B: That's true. We don't need to go do it. [00:41:18] Speaker C: Okay. [00:41:18] Speaker B: Final thoughts then? [00:41:19] Speaker A: Yeah, final thoughts. How do you do a final thought without a recommendation? I will say what I've already said, which is the show was disappointing and the movie was a wonderful, like, we were mentioning Virginia, you read it on the beach, and your friend or whoever challenged you to say, you're never going to finish that, like you're on vacation. So how did that go for you? How was that experience? Was it hard to return to the book to finish it? [00:41:49] Speaker C: Not even a little bit. Even with a pina colada calling my name. [00:41:53] Speaker A: Right. Even with multiple distractions? [00:41:57] Speaker C: Yeah, exactly. [00:41:58] Speaker E: Yeah. [00:41:59] Speaker B: I read it twice, and I still went back to read it every night after because I was reading the big friendly giant with my kids. After I would read that to them for bedtime, I would immediately be running back to read the book I've already read. But it was just like, I read it, I watched the series, and I was like, I can't wait to read this again, actually. [00:42:19] Speaker A: Yeah. It's just such a good story. [00:42:20] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I obviously agree. I was really looking forward to this one because I'd heard some really great things. And then near the end, I was starting to hear some mixed reviews about it. But I'm so glad that I read this book. And we had this opportunity with book interrupted to read it, too, because it was amazing and it was. I felt like it was everything that I've always thought about feminism and equality and how I would have felt, too, if I, you know, was transplanted in a different generation, you know, like, so let's say the sixties. Like, would I have thought, like, you know, misses frask? Or would I have thought, like, Elizabeth thought, you know, based on propaganda and based on what societal norms say? And it's exactly what I thought. Like, what Elizabeth thought's character embodies about, you know, being independent and being an equal human in the world? I loved it. I thought it was really great. I mean, there were some aspects about it that, like, maybe I tweak a little bit, but I think overall, it was a solid book. I think that everybody should read. [00:43:20] Speaker A: And, like, bravo for your first one. [00:43:23] Speaker C: Yes. [00:43:24] Speaker B: First one. Her next book. [00:43:28] Speaker A: That's a hard act to follow. [00:43:31] Speaker B: Yes. But I'll read her next book for sure. [00:43:34] Speaker A: Yeah. Just because of the first. [00:43:35] Speaker B: So enjoyable. Yeah. [00:43:37] Speaker A: I will read her next book, and even if I don't like it, I'll read her third book. That's how good her first book was. [00:43:42] Speaker B: Okay. [00:43:44] Speaker C: We would love to hear that. My goodness. That would be like, the greatest review. [00:43:48] Speaker A: No, you have earned my trust. And it will take multiple books to lose it. [00:43:52] Speaker C: It. [00:43:53] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:43:54] Speaker C: Apple TV. They need to do better. But it's getting there. [00:43:58] Speaker A: It's getting there. [00:44:01] Speaker B: No, I thought that women directors. So it's getting there. [00:44:04] Speaker C: Yeah. And it's nice that more and more of the messaging comes out. You know, what sort of reality is what women go through. So whether you want to hear it or not, you know, believe it. No, it's good. I like that. Okay. [00:44:16] Speaker A: All right. [00:44:17] Speaker B: That's it. [00:44:19] Speaker A: Very impressive. We ended literally as the clock would. Yeah. Let's not jinx it. Today was a very good day for timing and getting it all together. [00:44:32] Speaker C: It worked today. [00:44:33] Speaker B: It was great. [00:44:34] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:44:35] Speaker B: This interruption is brought to you by unpublished. Do you want to know more about the members and book interrupted? Go behind the scenes, visit our website at www.bookinterrupted.com. [00:44:48] Speaker A: Book interrupted. [00:44:50] Speaker D: Hi, Lindsey here. And this interruption is brought to you by gas. [00:44:56] Speaker B: Sure. [00:44:56] Speaker D: You've all had it. I don't really dairy, especially cow's milk and me don't sit super well together. And, you know, it's always hidden in places. And I had some indian food yesterday, and of course, there was yogurt, and I was fine. I was staying home. Karen, it was delicious. And then later on in the night, I was so gassy and so smelly. My poor partner. It was like, you know, you know, they joke about, like, being under the covers. You can't move the covers because if you move the covers, then the whole place smells. Yeah, that was me last night. And the poor guy, like, I know he knows because he knew I ate it. And, you know, I'm not gonna die or anything. It's just, like, so smelly and, like, it just creeps up on you. You're like, I'm fine. And then you're like, oh, don't come in this room. Don't come in this room. But because our apartment's not that big. Yeah, it kind of just wafts everywhere. So, yeah, that's my interruption. [00:45:55] Speaker A: Just smelly gas. Book interrupted. [00:45:59] Speaker B: It's book report time. We're gonna find out from each member their final thoughts. And do they recommend the book. Let's listen. [00:46:07] Speaker F: I'm Virginia, and this is my final book report for lessons in chemistry by Bonnie Varmas. So I would 100% recommend this book to anyone that has an interest in the subject matter, in gender equality, in science, and just a really nice story. I do think that this may not go down as, like, my top three books of all time. You know, maybe in the top ten. I'll always recommend this. Fondly about that. I think that it is a really nice story, like I said, with a really complex character. There was some tragedy in there as well, and the author went off the rails a little bit from how I would have thought the story would have flowed, you know, in her brain. But all in all, it was really well done. And I think that especially for book interrupted and a book club, I think there's so many themes in it that you can really dive into that would make a really great option. If someone is also looking to choose a book for their book club, it's. [00:47:10] Speaker B: A really good one. [00:47:11] Speaker F: So I would ten out of ten recommend this, but it doesn't go in top three books, maybe. Top ten. All right. I hope everyone has enjoyed reading this book, and I would love to hear any comments if you liked it or didn't. All right, thanks. [00:47:27] Speaker E: I have a lot to say about lessons in chemistry. Meredith here. I missed the group discussion, and I'm sorry that I did, because I have a lot to say. You'll notice that I'm wearing kind of a little. Little dress that I thought was appropriate for the book. And I've got my number two pencil in my hair. I really love the character of Elizabeth Zott. She is the heroine that we need in even more books. She knew who she was, and she didn't back down from anything. She was strong and unapologetic, a really great role model, and she believed in the women in the story, and it kind of made the reader seem seen as well. What a great book. So the most of what I have to say has to do with the limited series, the tv version of lessons in chemistry, which totally missed the mark. So this book was really about how women are just the same as men in the way that they are who they are, and they don't want to be defined by their gender. You know, Elizabeth Zott Washington. Not a woman chemist. She was a chemist. The fact that there had to be a qualifier, which is what drove her nuts. But I guess whoever decided to write the screenplay for the tv series thought to themselves, hmm, this story needs something. Let me see. Maybe a little bit more misogyny, maybe a little bit less feminism. We're gonna insert more of the patriarchy into this story. And I don't know what they were thinking. There were so many differences that just made this tv series just so unenjoyable to watch. Can I just go through the list? Because it just drove me nuts. In the book, Elizabeth Salt was a chemist, and people kept on thinking she was a lab tech, and she was like, I'm not a lab tech. And instead, they just made her a lab tech in the series, which is, like, right there. I mean, what's the point? In the book, she needs to make a little bit extra money. She's doing the work of her male colleagues to get money. She's doing their work because she's more capable, and yet she doesn't have the opportunities that she spoke that she could have if she was a man. And in the series, she's selling Tupperware. That is not her identity. She would find so many other ways to make money other than selling Tupperware. And I get they're trying to, like, make it retro and insert things, but they totally missed the mark on Elizabeth Zott in the limited series. Her producer is giving her a pep talk so she can feel confident going on camera. She didn't need help feeling confident. And that character, his character was the one who lacked confidence. He was supposed to be a contrast. The incom. I was gonna say incompetent. The. The man who's not confident getting his confidence from a woman who knows who she is and is very sure and very comfortable in her own skin. In part of the tv series, she says something like, I don't know who I am if I don't do this show. Which, I mean, at that point, I just wanted to turn it off, and at the same time, I wanted to watch it just so that I could talk about it here. And that wasn't her. She didn't like being on tv. She almost found it beneath her. And that's part of it, is that the fact that she thought it was beneath her and she did this big thing, but she grew as a character because she realized that it was important to her audience that they could feel seen. It wasn't like, oh, I'm gonna lose something by losing this show. There were so many things that they did that was just not true to the book, not true to the character and changing the story. So it's more comfortable under a male gaze rather than a female gaze. Yeah, I just. There's so much. The investor at the end also went from being a very strong woman, sure about herself and talking about some hard issues, and they really, really dampened it down. Let's just not upset anybody. Just like the teacher character in the book versus the show. In the book, she was kind of this small person who was judgmental and did not see her daughter for who she was. And in the show, they're like, we don't want to upset the teachers. Instead, what we'll do is we'll make the teacher sees her daughter and realizes she needs to be in a gifted program instead of being another person that made it difficult for a girl or a woman to succeed in this male dominated world. You know, all this stuff. I hated the series. It kind of left a bad taste of my mouth. And my husband, who hasn't read the book, he's watching the last episode with me. He's like, is this for real? Like, it was bad. He's like, this is bad writing. And he hadn't even read the book, so it was groan worthy for him, too. In fact, I almost felt like it was gaslighting me to the point where I reread the book. I read the book another time after watching the series to be like, did I make that up? Did I make up Elizabeth Zot and who I thought she was? And the answer is no. So if you like the book, don't waste your time and watch the show. And if you hated the book, well, you might just love it. So, you know, you could go either way on these things, but I don't think you're gonna like them both. That's it. That's my rant. It was really long, but that's it. I'll see you next time. [00:52:49] Speaker A: Final book report for lessons in chemistry by Kim. I loved this book. This book was fantastic. You've heard in our episode why I think it's fantastic. I think I really need to change. When I do my book reports, I keep on doing them after we have our group discussion, and then I struggle to have new things to talk about or say. So that's what's happening right now. But I really did like this book. Like, the book was really good. It's one of those books that you look forward to going back to. It's not a chore or it didn't feel like an assignment to have to read it like I wanted to read it. I will recommend it to others. I will recommend it to you right now. Dear reader, read the book. So good. Now with that being said, the Apple tv series I didn't finish because it was different than the book and I really liked the book and so I didn't want to keep on watching the tv series because it was veering off. Yeah, I'm surprised by it only because when I read a book and I love it, I definitely want to watch the series. But that's exactly why I stopped watching the series, because it wasn't the book that I loved anymore. It was whatever the series was doing. I would still recommend this series to people, I guess, because it's still a pretty good story. But if people wanted to know which one they should read, the answer is in the question. Read the book. The series is fine, but the book is just so much better. Like this is a classic case of book was way better than movie or in this case, tv series. Classic things that were changed in the tv series, a didn't need to be changed and b dramatically impacted some of the best. Like some of the things that were best about the book by changing these little things that there was no need to change. I don't understand in the show why certain things were changed. I don't know that it eased the storytelling. I don't know that it doesn't. There's not an apparent reason why those decisions were made. And so it's hard for me to get on board with it because as far as I can tell, the book was perfect. So whoever made the Green Mile and the Shawshank redemption into a movie should have done lessons in chemistry because they did a good job, they didn't mess with perfection, and the result was a good thing to watch as well as a good thing to read. Unfortunately, in this case, the results are not the same. So if you only can do one, definitely read the book. If you have time to do both, read the book first. I wonder if you watched the show first and then read the book, what you'd think. The book is just so much better. That is all I have to say about it for now, but definitely recommend lessons in chemistry, super good read, great story, storytelling and then me. That's my recommendation for the show. Watch it if you want, but also don't watch it if you don't want to because you're not missing that much. [00:56:06] Speaker B: I have read this book before and I also, if you listened to the season three recap, thought it would be my favorite. I really like this book. I love the character Elizabeth thought so much it's really good. I watched the series, too, and I think the casting was good, in my opinion, but I didn't like it as much as the book. I think they did an okay job. They just changed a lot of things, and I can understand the changes. I'm sure it makes a better series, the things that they changed, but I like the book better. I think what I'm realizing in this season is I actually don't mind the movies and series completely on their own. I usually like the book better, although I guess I like sometimes I like the movie better in this season. This particular book is really good, and the ending of the book is, in my opinion, better than the ending of the show. So I want to put that out there. What else do I want to say? This book has a lot of women's rights and, you know, fighting the patriarchy. And I just like how she just keeps on moving forward. I really loved her relationship with her partner in life. Soul mate, she calls him her soulmate, Calvin. There's so much character development in the book with each one of the characters that you're really so invested in all the characters in this book. The author just did such a great job at it. I mean, I'm sure even today it's hard to be a chemist and a woman. Just generally being in a field that has more men, which I have been in the past. I mean, it's better, but it's still not perfect. It just isn't there. Was would you rather off the shelf? And I went down to rabbit hole thinking, maybe I'll like, tie it into this book, lessons in chemistry and see if we can find feminist one. But it was just so disheartening. I found some articles about women writing it for things that they've experienced just makes you depressed when you think about it. Things like, would you rather be told to smile or always be underestimated as incompetent? It's just like, or like, for me, would you rather be asked to get coffee or be called eye candy for a trade show? What would you rather? Anyway? So I think it stirs up a lot of emotions if you're a woman reading it. But I also really love the dog in this book because she teaches him to read, and they also have a voice of the dog in the book. He speaks. He's a real character, has thoughts and feelings. It makes the book so endearing. Anyway, I highly recommend it. It still is my pick so far for the season, so if you haven't read it, you should read it. Alright, that's it. Thank you for joining us on this episode of book Interrupted. If you'd like to see the video highlights from this episode, please go to our YouTube channel book interrupted. You can also find our videos on www.bookinterrupted.com. [00:59:14] Speaker E: Are you interested in joining the conversation and having your comment played on the podcast? Simply find a quiet place and record a voice memo, then send it to connectookinterrupted.com. or you could do the old fashioned way and leave us a voicemail at 416-900-8603 we look forward to hearing from you soon. [00:59:35] Speaker A: Book interrupted never forget, every child matters.